The Game Business Journey

Kevin and Brodie Game with their young family, dairy at Bemboka on the far south coast of NSW and have worked hard at achieving their goals over the last 12 years. From small beginnings they have grown into a large and profitable business, with the inevitable ups and downs along the way. They have also just reached the end of their first year as the NSW Focus Farm which has provided them with great support and guidance, so along with Kevin and Brodie, I am joined by Justin Walsh who is facilitating their Focus Farm project.

We often hear that it is too hard for young people to get into dairying and ultimately own their own farm, unless they are fortunate enough to already be part of a family-owned generational business.

Today we hear how a dream such as this can become a reality through good planning, management and being able to make the most of opportunities when they present themselves.

Useful resources related to this podcast:

Leasing dairy assets resource pack

Dairy NSW facebook page

This podcast is an initiative of the NSW DPI Dairy Business Advisory Unit

It is brought to you in partnership the Hunter Local Land Services

Please share this podcast with your fellow farmers and colleagues and feel free to contact us with suggestions or comments via this email address thebusinessofdairy@gmail.com

Further NSW DPI Dairy channels to follow and subscribe to include;

NSW DPI Dairy Facebook page

DPI Intensive Livestock Twitter feed

NSW DPI Dairy Newsletter

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Produced by Video Lift

The information discussed in this podcast are for informative and educational purposes only and do not constitute advice. 

Transcript

The Business of Dairy 

Episode #16 Transcript – “The Game Business Journey”

Sheena Carter: Welcome to the Business of Dairy Podcast, I'm Sheena Carter, Development Officer with the New South Wales Department of Primary Industries Dairy Team. We often hear that it is too hard for young people to get into dairying and ultimately own their own farm unless they're fortunate enough to already be part of a family owned generational business. Today we hear how a dream such as this can become a reality through good planning, management and being able to make the most of opportunities when they present themselves. Kevin and Brodie Game, with their young family, dairy at Bemboka on the far south coast of New South Wales and have worked hard at achieving their goals over the last 12 years. From small beginnings, they have grown into a large and profitable business – with the inevitable ups and downs along the way. They've also just reached the end of their first year as the New South Wales Focus Farm, which has provided them with great support and guidance. So along with Kevin and Brodie, I am joined by Justin Walsh who is facilitating their Focus Farm project. Welcome to the Business of Dairy Podcast, Brodie, Kevin and Justin, it's great to have you all here. 

Brodie & Kevin Game: Thanks for having us. 

Justin Walsh: Hi, Sheena.

Sheena Carter: Hey Justin, good to have you back on. I think this is your second podcast with us now. 

Justin Walsh: Yes it is actually. Looking forward to it. 

Sheena Carter: Good stuff. The logical start to this is to start at the beginning, I guess. Kevin and Brodie, you're pretty well known in the New South Wales dairying circles. Brodie you've immersed himself in all sorts of industry groups and programs as well, but I'm keen for you to just share with us how you both started in dairying. So Kevin, if we can flick to you first, what's your background? Where are you from? How did your passion for dairying start and how did you develop that? 

Kevin Game: So I grew up in the Bega Valley, obviously went to Bega High School, finished high school and always had a keen interest in farming. My mum and dad had a feedlot in between Bemboka and Bega, they sort of left and went out west and I stayed and got a dairy apprenticeship on a farm out here at Bemboka and then yeah, sort of progressed from there. 

Sheena Carter: Good. So you don't actually have any, you know, you haven't been born and raised on a dairy farm? It come, sort of, the interest from seeing other dairy farmers in the region and the lifestyle, or what's attracted you to it? 

Kevin Game: Yeah, all of that. I was, sort of, you know, there were a lot of dairy farms down here at that stage and dad said I had to have an apprenticeship and it was between that and butchering. So, you know, obviously I took dairying and that's sort of where I’ve stayed. I've been out west a couple of times for a few years and just wanted to see how they did it over the hill and bring a bit of that back home. 

Sheena Carter: Brodie, I guess you've got similarities to Kevin in that you're not from a dairy farm. How did you end up in dairying, I know you've been very involved with lots of groups which we can talk about as well, but how did you get into dairying yourself? 

Brodie Game: I started in high school with beef cattle. I don't even know why, but somebody approached me and asked me if I wanted to come and show some steers and cows with the show team at high school and I ended up being that kid that was down at the ag farm at lunchtime feeding the steers and came back stinking of cows. But I took a shine to do that, the showing and the cattle presentation and preparation and actually went to a dairy farm for my work experience in Year 10. It was the intensive nature of dairy that attracted me to it because I always loved the cows and my beef cows and that involvement, but you‘re with the cows every day and that really drew me. The cows are where my passion lies, so I've sort of stuck with that and came across Kev, and yeah, we went down that journey together. 

Sheena Carter: Right, and where did you both bump into each other? 

Brodie Game: On that farm I did work experience on. 

Sheena Carter: Ah right, so it's been a while? Good stuff. Now, you've also… Brodie, you really have immersed yourself, I guess, in the industry, not only in terms of actually operating, you know, dairy businesses, but also involvement with groups within the industry. You've been the secretary of the Far South Dairy Development Group and you've been involved with other, sort of, discussion groups around Bega. The Dairy Research Foundation Symposium was held in Bega in 2019, I think it was, and you spoke at that, which was brilliant, and you're currently the vice president of the New South Wales Women in Dairy organisation as well. So yeah, there's no holding you back, and we should also give the Women in Dairy Bale Up conference a bit of a plug, which is in September, 13th to the 15th of September, so look it up on Facebook if you're interested. And in my Googling of Brodie, I also came across the fact that, you know what I'm going to say, don’t you? In 2014 you were the Royal Easter Show Showgirl, first out of 16 competitors, so you're certainly out and about. So well done. 

Brodie Game: People just know that I can't say no. I'm an easy target. 

Sheena Carter: Well, not saying no creates opportunities, so yeah, I think that's a good thing… sometimes. Now, how did we start this journey into dairying? Obviously working on dairy farms has kicked it off, but you've had to start to get some, you know, skin in the game, you've had to get assets behind you. How did you start this journey? I guess it was sort of, you know, around cow ownership, but how did you start all this? 

Kevin Game: After a few management roles and stuff down here in Bega, Brodie was from Cootamundra, and I thought it seemed like a good idea to move to Cootamundra for a few years. I worked on sheep places and in cattle places in the tyre service, and then leased a little stock reserve in between Wallendbeen and Cootamundra, and bought two chopper cows off a dairy farmer down here and started rearing bull calves. And, you know, eventually that that grew into six cows, I think we had, and over 100 calves on milk. We had established a relationship with a bloke that was taking every calf that we could rear in Gunning. I was working full time, plus milking cows in the morning and afternoon after work, and doing that, which gave us a bit of cash to buy a couple more cows, and because I was coming back and forth to Bega buying bull calves, I heard that Blacker’s dairy farm in Bega, where we started, the bloke that was on it was getting off, and I had no idea how I was going to do it, but I just called in and seen the bloke, the fella that owns the place, and yeah, sort of left there and, you know, he asked me how many cows I had, and I only had six, so I never thought that was going to come off, but three weeks later he rang me up and said, do you want to come down here and run the place for me, I’ll buy the herd. Yeah, I was super excited. I rang Brodie at work and about a week later we were down at Leongatha looking at a herd of cows. 

Sheena Carter: So moved pretty quickly. Brodie, what was your initial response? 

Brodie Game: I never even milked the cows to start with, that was not my jam at all. I worked in livestock at Landmark in Wagga in the saleyards and Kev has always been very much the driving force and I just have to find a way to make these things happen. And he did send me a picture of the front gate of the farm that he came down and looked at, yeah, it was a big decision, but yeah, it was something to do on our own and why not? I mean, I love cows and it was something we enjoyed, so the cows at home with the bull calves had worked really well and that was the next step I guess, so we just jumped in. 

Sheena Carter: Good stuff. So perhaps a little bit of fear and trepidation, but lots of opportunity that you could see. And I guess, Kevin, it really highlights the importance of, you know, keeping your ears to the ground and talking and networking, doesn't it? Because, you know, you don't find those sort of opportunities in in the newspaper or online on Facebook. 

Kevin Game: Well, that's right, and it is vital, you know, like every opportunity that came up, you know, whether it was big or small, I'd look into it, and I guess we got our name out there and people knew we were pretty keen to do something and you know, that paid off in the end I guess. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah, well and truly. So now we've moved back to Bega on this farm and we've got a herd of cows that are being financed through the owner of that farm, is that correct? 

Brodie Game: Yes, so with the money we'd saved up from the bull calves, we bought 65 cows of our own and the rest of the herd was vendor financed with the share farmer, so we were making monthly payments against those just to try and build that asset a little bit more. 

Kevin Game: So, effectively, at the start it was, we're buying one cow a month for the business. 

Sheena Carter: Awesome. So you're in this share farming arrangement and then we've hit a bit of a bump in the road with milk pricing and Theileria, which sort of, you know, impacted the business a little bit. And what happened as a result of that? 

Brodie Game: We moved here in December 2012, so that summer of 2012/13 wasn't a great one and the milk price was not in a good position, so we were sort of okay with that, and then buying in a lot of cows we were… I don’t think Theileria had been very present down here previous to that, or it wasn't spoken about and we, sort of, had never heard of it, and we lost one cow and I was like devastated. I was like… I'm very much an animal person, and Kev's like, it's okay, it doesn't happen very often, and we lost 30 in the next month, and I was like, what are we doing here? I mean, we took a hit with production in that way, but losing cows as well, and then trying to keep the sick ones alive – Theileria was at a fair learning curve. But we definitely made some good relationships with the vet through that. But probably with those two things bundled together, we weren't experienced enough to have had a proper share farming agreement drawn up and the farm owner decided that he didn't want to share farm anymore, it wasn't profitable for him, but I think at that point, I know for me especially, it was at that point that I realised that I had actually found something that I really loved doing and we didn't want to stop doing it. So we sort of jumped headfirst and said, well we'll lease the farm instead because we weren't prepared to give up what we started to create. 

Kevin Game: The thing is, we had put every cent that we had to our name into the 65 cows, so I was going to go down fighting. 

Sheena Carter: It is a monumental hit. And when, you know, 30 cows you said, Brodie, that's a fairly large proportion of the herd, isn't it? Which is tough going. And so on that farm you were milking how many at that point? 

Brodie Game: I think we were up to about 200 at that point. The farm was a passion project for us as well, because there was so much potential to improve it and increase production, and that's something that Kev really thrives on. So it was a good farm for us to, sort of, prove to ourselves and then we sort of realised that there was a lot of other people watching that we weren't aware of, I mean it was on the side of the highway so it was probably obviously people watching, but it became apparent how many people were watching what we were doing as well.

Sheena Carter: Yes, okay, so you're a bit under the microscope and had a bit to prove. 

Brodie Game: Yeah, exactly. 

Kevin Game: Not only that, you know, from those people watching presented a lot of opportunity, you know, i.e. our neighbour that offered to vendor finance the herd after we left that farm. She just watched and realised what a good job we were doing, even though, you know, we were just doing what we had to do to make the farm work. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah, I could see the potential. That's a great story, Kevin, that's amazing. There are some really supportive people in this industry and it's good to see things like that happen. So you've mentioned that you started a lease on this farm. How did you go about that in terms of setting up the lease? What sort of structures did you have in place and how did you do it? 

Brodie Game: I think because we sort of were a little bit shy because we didn't have that share farming agreement drawn up, we went through a solicitor to draw up the lease arrangement and that was sort of just a bit of to and froing between us and the solicitor and the farm owners of what fit best for everyone. So there was different clauses there around the pasture management, what we could and couldn't do there, but there was also clauses that protected us in terms of if big things broke down, the portions that we'd have to pay for and the farmer would have to pay, but we just wanted that protection, I guess, so everyone was on the same page. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah, excellent, and I think that's key. Obviously, there was some good communication between you and the farmer as well to enable all that to happen. Good, honest, open communication. 

Brodie Game: Yeah, it wouldn't have happened without that. Something we had to learn along the way, I think. 

Sheena Carter: Yep, fantastic. You’ve leased this farm for how long? 

Brodie Game: We were there for three years. 

Sheena Carter: Right, okay. And then the next step in the Kevin and Brodie journey occurred and you've left that farm. Where have you gone to next? 

Kevin Game: I guess, you know, going back to what I said before about people watching, the opportunities that came from that was a another farmer that, a dairy farmer who was dairying himself out at Bemboka, and he'd heard our lease was up in there, even though he wasn't quite ready to finish dairying himself, he actually contacted us… 

Brodie Game: The classifier had been to the farm that we're on now and came to us next and he said, oh he wants to lease you the farm one day, and I didn't even know who he was at that point, and that started that initial conversation. 

Kevin Game: I think I actually messaged him that day. 

Brodie Game: Kev’s not shy. 

Sheena Carter: No, no, again, it's, what is it, carpe diem? Seize the day, away we go. 

Kevin Game: So that was a bit bigger farm and give us a bit more opportunity to get into some more cows, and you know, there was a bit more irrigation and that sort of thing, a better dairy. 

Sheena Carter: Do you want to describe the farm to us a bit Kevin, what you’ve, sort of, got in terms of acreage, pastures, and the irrigation availability, that sort of stuff? 

Kevin Game: So there’s 174 hectares in the actual milking platform, of which about 100 hectares of it is irrigated. It's got a 25-a-side dairy on it with a 10,000 litre vat. 

Sheena Carter: What's your pasture base? 

Kevin Game: So yeah, wheat and ryegrass, mainly annual. We've got 25 hectares of perennial that we put in two years ago and we're just going to start the rotation with that. It had a few weeds that needed cleaning up with the annual, so we did that for three or four years before we started putting in the perennials, and now we're just going to keep that going, probably in 25 hectare blocks. 

Brodie Game: There's a fairly solid kikuyu base across the farm as well. 

Sheena Carter: And what's your calving pattern? 

Brodie Game: Generally, over the years we've changed to, sort of, we start February and we try to finish that October/November, I guess you’d call it year-round, but we try to hold it within those months. We do have a bigger batch in February with most of our heifers calving and then a bigger batch again in August. Of our feed wedge, that sort of suits us as best here, and then over that summer period, you've got Christmas and it's really hot, so it's easier on the cows, it's easier on staff, and that sort of suits us pretty well. 

Sheena Carter: So you've been on that farm since 2016, that's about right? Kev, you said you've been able to… well, you're able to increase cow numbers on that farm as well, have better capability for that? 

Kevin Game: Yep, so once again, we did get a little bit lucky. The farm owner financed, I think it was 80 that we bought off him?

Brodie Game: We bought 80 cows off him and then we bought… I think he had a soft spot for some cows but he wasn't willing to share that, so he told me they were cull cows that he couldn't sell to anyone else, so we bought those as we sold our own chopper cows, but it turns out they weren't so much cull cows, they were just his favourites. So yeah, a portion of those were heifers and we just paid those off on top of our other vendor finance. So we did gear ourselves up pretty heavily with debt, but we sort of wanted to get that knocked over because it was always the intention that once that debt was gone, that we’d be sweet to buy a farm. There was more to that but that was our initial idea. 

Sheena Carter: Okay, and I guess we're in a period in time where there's some pretty challenging conditions across, certainly New South Wales, coming into that drought period, which was very, very tough in terms of, you know, obviously very difficult to grow pasture and very expensive to buy fodder in. And then unfortunately also down in your part of the world, there was the impact of the bushfires as well. Those are both incredibly significant challenges. How did you respond to those challenges? 

Kevin Game: The biggest thing we did was we had another block leased to grow our heifers out on, on which it had a dairy as well. It had irrigation out of a dam, so we did we decided to split the herd. 

Brodie Game: Because up until that point, we'd been about, really strongly, our focus had been on growing our herd. When you start at two, you just want to grow and grow and grow, and we got to 400 cows so we had enough to split the herd at that point. We'd probably gone past the sweet spot, but we hadn't realised that at that point, so that was when we did split the herd. 

Kevin Game: But having had those cow numbers is ultimately what got us out of it because it sort of got to a point where it got so dry, where there was no water anywhere, and we had those extra 160 or 170 cows that we could effectively cash in to keep the other 200 going. By the time we had done all that, it rained. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah, well, and I guess, you know, we've been lucky. It was a terrible, terrible drought but I think as an industry, not only the dairy industry, but also the beef industry, we've been fortunate in that period that there's still been some incredibly good cattle prices, which yeah, has really helped people with cash flow through those tight times. So yeah, a common story I think through that period with many farms in New South Wales. And then the bushfires had a bit of an impact on your business as well? 

Brodie Game: Yeah, so that farm that we did split the herd, we gave that up and just tried to focus on old Bemboka with a much smaller herd. So we were back down, we were well under 200, if anything I think we were at 220 cows, and then we decided to lease the second farm that we have now and that, sort of, just as the bushfires came, so the second farm was completely burnt out. Our farm at home wasn't burnt as such. We did lose a few cows afterwards, which through some investigations was from smoke and a few other things. But yeah, certainly not as impacted as a lot of people, but just getting feed and water and trying to keep everything alive was an interesting adventure. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah, one foot in front of the other each day. I'd just like to touch on the Dairy Research Foundation symposium, which was in Bega in 2019, and you were one of the guest speakers at that event, Brodie, and I remember your presentation, I was actually there and it was a fantastic presentation, but you mentioned some specific goals that you had for the business and yourselves at that time, and you know, some of that was that, sort of, growing your wealth in the dairy business, which you were doing at the time, but you also made a comment around you changed your philosophy of being a production focused business. What did you mean by that? 

Brodie Game: Like I said, we were always about growth, and when we did hit that we did sell all those cows. We sort of had to change our mindset that we needed a cow that we could milk and feed effectively to produce as much as she could, rather than feed a lot of mouths half full, we should feed the ones we've got so they produce to their potential. So that was sort of where our focus changed and we became a much… not that we weren't aware of our costs before, but we tried to focus in on those and just squeeze every dollar for what we could. I mean, there was a lot of stress behind the scenes at that point. I guess there was a few times we worked out how much the herd was worth if we just cashed it all in and it was done, and we knew we would be in an okay spot if we did that, we'd clear our debt, but we always came back to it that we would just pack up and try and start again somewhere else, so why not fix what we've got here? So we sort of changed that direction in what sort of cows we were breeding and how we were managing them. 

Sheena Carter: Right, and so it was more production yes, but you know, profitable production rather than just lots of production. 

Brodie Game: Yes. 

Kevin Game: Don’t be afraid to milk an ugly crossbred. 

Sheena Carter: Milk is milk isn't it, Kevin? It doesn't matter, milk solids are milk solids.

Kevin Game: Also what we did was sort of change the frame size of our cows to suit the hills we've got down here, and the distance that they've got to walk, we just sort of went for a smaller frame Holstein that was going to produce the same kilos I guess as a big flash animal that's going to eat a lot more feed. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah, just for maintenance. 

Brodie Game: Kev really worked hard on making the most out of the land that we did lease. So there was a lot of pockets that weren't being used to their full potential, so there was a lot of improvement that went into those to bring them in to either the milking platform or the fodder production. 

Sheena Carter: Excellent. We're getting closer to the present day in your journey, and you're actually now one year into your journey as a New South Wales Focus Farm, which has seen some very important activity and direction for the business. But before we dive into this, Justin, you're facilitating the Game’s Focus Farm under the mentorship of Phil Shannon, and you've also been a Focus Farm in the recent past. So firstly, can you explain to listeners what a Focus Farm is all about? Obviously, it's a Dairy Australia program that happens across many regions in Australia. But what's it all about, how does it operate? 

Justin Walsh: Yeah Sheena, so essentially it's a two year program. It's basically described as real farmers making real decisions in real time that we can look at real results of. So it's not necessarily supposed to be best practice or a model farm, so to speak, it's intended to be a relatable farm in some way. So to become the Focus Farm, there's only one in New South Wales and it runs for two years, as I said, and so that is essentially an application process which then goes to interviews and then a Focus Farm is awarded and then once that happens, then a facilitator is selected between Dairy New South Wales and the Focus Farmers, in this case Kevin and Brodie, and I was fortunate enough to get that position under the mentorship of a very experienced Focus Farm facilitator, Phil Shannon. Once a facilitator is appointed, we then work with Kevin and Brodie in this case, to develop a support group. That support group is, let's say about 15 people, but there's no sort of right or wrong answer on how many people that group should be, but it's made up of a combination of farmers and service providers. And farmers may be some younger farmers with some new ideas; some older, more established farmers; and it's a real cross-section of local farmers. And then service providers, you know, we're talking about, potentially vets – the vet that the farmer uses – agronomists maybe, maybe a bank manager on different occasions, and potentially a rep from the processor which they supply. So really just a group of people that work in with that farm already because they’re critically important as well. So once that's established, then we sort of get into the… you know, that’s where the rubber hits the road and we start actually getting into the Focus Farm program. So we have regular meetings, it's roughly every two months, but it's sort of seasonal, it can depend on what's happening or if there's a time period where not as much is happening, you might have a break over Christmas and New Year's, etc. So if there's some critical time frames, well then try and have a meeting based around what's actually going on the farm. So those meetings are confidential and that's to build trust within the group and to create some good, open and honest discussion. And that's a real key element of that, because without that, we certainly wouldn't get the in-depth discussion that we do get at Focus Farms. And then further to that, then we have a series of open days. So the open day is essentially an invitation to the rest of the dairy industry, or anyone else that may be interested in coming along, and it's where we get a chance to report back what's going on on the Focus Farm. That might be what has worked, what maybe hasn't worked, what opportunities, what direction we're heading in. The first one, which we've had, is really an introductory to what the farm is hoping to achieve and it's a way of the broader industry following along the journey with everyone. Because there are obviously things that would be relevant to other farmers who aren't in the support group or in different areas in New South Wales or around the country. So that's essentially how a Focus Farm runs. 

Sheena Carter: Okay fantastic, and I think it's invaluable having that support group, obviously all those people bring their own experiences and skills and knowledge to the table, to Kevin and Brodie, help you in your thought processes and decision making, so it is a unique opportunity. I mean, you can always have conversations to people, as Kevin certainly does, you know, about general things, but to have that collective group and banter about with ideas. Justin, and I know this is not about your business journey, but can we just touch on your Focus Farm experience? What motivated you to get involved, as a Focus Farmer I'm saying, and what were the benefits ultimately to your business over that two year journey? 

Justin Walsh: Well, I actually started as part of a support group on the Focus Farm prior to our own Focus Farm, and that's where I got a taste for it and saw the potential and, you know, how helpful something like this could be, and so, you know, to go through the benefits of becoming the Focus Farm for myself personally, it's sort of too long to list – we'd have to have a podcast that would last for a few days, so we don't want to bore the listeners today. So initially, I guess the timing was right for us when we applied. We'd just taken over the running of the business from my parents and we were sort of two years into that, so we had a sense of where we were, got a good feel for maybe some potential there and we really wanted some direction about where we should take things because the last thing we wanted to do is get ten years down the road and think we should have done things differently. So that's really where it came from and then, I will say that Focus Farm isn't for everyone, it can be quite confronting at times or you know, you’re fairly exposed. I often tell people it's more like Focus Life than Focus Farm because it does delve into some pretty personal areas and the spotlight really is on you and your business and your family. So having said all that, it really has changed my life and our business forever. The benefits to putting yourself out there have been immense and, you know, things happen here on a daily basis now that are a regular occurrence that I wouldn't have dreamed possible before we started. And then it's opened up so many doors, networking and things like that. That's been one of the things that I hadn't sort of accounted for when I first went into this, that the networking potential and who you meet along the way and what falls out at the end of all this, aside from the benefits to your personal business. 

Sheena Carter: That's one thing I think about the dairy industry in Australia, but particularly in New South Wales, if you’re half interested in something and you just half put your hand up, someone else will lift it up the whole way in you’re in boots and all, just like that. Next minute you turn around, what happened? Okay, fantastic. Kevin and Brodie what were the motivators for you to get involved with the Focus Farm? 

Brodie Game: I think I had to twist Kev’s arm a little. We were at a point, like you said before, we just come out of the drought and the bushfires, we were down to a pretty low number of cows for the farm we had, and we didn't know where we were going any more. We didn't know whether this was the industry we should still be in. I think we were just lost and our confidence had been pretty shot. We were pretty scared to take any risk of buying any more cows until we had… we said we wanted five pits of silage behind ourselves before we bought anymore cows. Applying for the Focus Farm, I think I said it to Kev, was just that it was, sort of, a last resort in our hopes that somebody could help us. I think deep down we never wanted to give up that dream of buying a farm but we needed someone to say it to us straight, whether it was ever going to happen or not. 

Sheena Carter: It's relentless. You know, you've been through a period where you're constantly having to make decisions every day just to survive and get through, and then you come to a point, it's like you just don't have any energy anymore to do that kind of stuff, and I think the beauty of the Focus Farm what you've done is you've let that outside set of eyes come in, which yeah, sometimes it's a good thing and sometimes it's a bad thing, but it does give you a bit of a sense of, are we on the right track? How can we make this happen? 

Kevin Game: You know, the biggest part for me especially was we'd always held, you know, especially our financial cards so close to our chests that it all built up, and to be able to regurgitate that to everyone in the group was just a massive relief on its own because everybody, you know, we thought we were in a really bad position and they’re like, it's not so bad after all. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah, give you some perspective. 

Kevin Game: That's right. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah, good stuff. Justin, if we just flick back to you, and we've mentioned there's a support group that forms part of this journey, how did you get everyone in this support group on the same page as Kevin and Brodie and, you know, work out where the opportunities for the business were and what was the forward direction? 

Justin Walsh: Well, initially the first couple of meetings, and in particular the first meeting is sort of critical in setting the course of where this journey is going to go. So the first meeting was really about how do we get the support group inside Kevin and Brodie’s heads. So understanding where they're at, where they want to go, and really just getting a sense of, okay these are the resources we're working with and really getting a good snapshot of where we're starting from. That was at their first initial meeting and it's all… we did a SWOT analysis, which many people have done before, well, the support group did, and those results are sort of collated and that was, well, anonymously, I suppose. Kevin and Brodie didn't actually see who said what on those analysis, which potentially now we might not have needed to do that, but keeping in mind, this is the very first meeting and Kevin and Brodie, and very much to their credit, laid their cards on the table, which was absolutely critical because when people are making recommendations or suggestions about where the future of this business, and where Kevin and Brodie should go, without that information it's really hard to create some really good informed discussion about that. So that was absolutely critical and a lot of the initial meetings were about that, and it was very clear early on, we had this overarching theme of the potential farm purchase. And so then we went about establishing what is called a goal hierarchy. So we have the farm purchase at the top, if you're picturing a pyramid, you've got the farm purchase at the top of the pyramid, and basically we want to set some goals and milestones underneath that that actually lead us to that purchase. So Kevin and Brodie and the group, very early on we had these three key questions, which was, should they buy this farm, or should they be aiming to buy his farm? Because it's not farm purchase or bust. There's some fantastic success stories in the dairy industry that don't involve a farm purchase, so it's not always a given that farm purchase is the end goal. So the group then worked around, was this an appropriate end goal for Kevin and Brodie? Is this something they should be aiming for? And so that was the key question, number one. Then for the following question, which was probably more Kevin and Brodie's main question, was could they? So could they do this, or was it a reasonable expectation that this would actually be achieved? So there was a lot of time spent working through that question and then probably the final question of the first 12 months of the Focus Farm was will they? And ultimately that was up to Kevin and Brodie, but we as a support group and in the facilitation role, our job was to have some really robust discussion about the consequences of that decision. So pros, cons, the risks, the opportunities, and then ultimately, obviously the ball’s in Kevin and Brodie's court about where they take that. So a lot of that discussion dominated the first 12 months of the Focus Farm and that dictated where we went and that was all set up at that initial meeting, and that was credit to Kevin and Brodie for giving the support group all the information that they needed to answer those three key questions that everything, sort of, worked from there. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah, you’re kind of baring your soul aren’t you, Kevin and Brodie? 

Brodie Game: That first meeting is pretty exhausting. 

Sheena Carter: So the should they, could they, and will they? What had to change or what, perhaps has changed, in the business in the first 12 months of the Focus Farm journey to enable you to answer those questions, particularly on farm, what's changed and how? 

Kevin Game: Well I think, like Brodie said, we were pretty shellshocked after the fires and the drought and everything and we just weren't game to make any bold moves anymore, and the Focus Farm, or everyone in it, seen the farm and said, you’re clearly not milking enough cows. That was the first thing we had to do and we still weren't really convinced, but then we went through with the Focus Farm and did all the figures on it and it just made sense. I think we bought 60 cows, 60 more cows that week. 

Brodie Game: We'd been looking for direction for so long and when somebody said, this is what you need to do, we were still a little bit muddled in our own heads so we still put buying the farm to the back, but yeah, after that first meeting we bought the extra 60 cows on some Bega Cheese funding, which we paid off, we went away and downsized our car and put our investment house on the market. So that first meeting we just, sort of, went with it and ran. I’m not sure whether that was recommended, but that's what we did. 

Sheena Carter: Well, I guess to make these things work, sometimes you've got to make those sacrifices for the ultimate goal, haven’t you? So you've well and truly gone in boots and all, I mean you were already in boots and all, I must say, you're pretty reactive so hats off to you, that's incredible. 

Brodie Game: It gave Kev permission to buy something so he was, like, all in.

Justin Walsh: Can I add something in, Sheena, or not? I was going to say that in working through those three questions, the question of ‘should I’ was emphatically yes. The group was yes, this is a sensible good idea. And then question two of ‘could they’, I think the group – and Kevin and Brodie cut me off if you think I’m saying too much – but essentially was, not right now, but yes. Yes, but not right now. And then it was a matter of working to that. And so how I describe it is, the business was, essentially when we started, out of alignment. So to visualise that, for anyone who plays Jenga, if you think of a Jenga stack and all those blocks are different aspects of your farm, so when that Jenga stack first goes on the table, that's a really resilient, perfectly aligned business. So then, when we got to Kevin and Brodie, they’d been impacted by bushfires, droughts, and every time you say one of those things, you're pulling one of those blocks away from that Jenga stack. And so they'd reduced cow numbers so they didn't have enough cows, so we've pulled another block out and when they were milking a lot of cows, they'd taken on some financing costs that were more appropriate for a much larger herd size, so we've taken another block out and we just had this business that we just tried to work on – can we start bringing these blocks back into the centre of this Jenga stack so that they're in a much better position to then move forward with potentially the farm purchase down the track? 

Sheena Carter: Good, that's an excellent explanation. 

Justin Walsh: Do you like that? I've been working on that for weeks. 

Sheena Carter: You’re not as quick as Kevin and Brodie, they do these things overnight. 

Justin Walsh: Yeah, that's right. 

Sheena Carter: So I guess if we want to reflect back on the last 12 months in terms of season, Kevin and Brodie, how has the season been over that period compared to what you've been through? 

Kevin Game: Well, I hate to say it because I know a lot of people in a different position, but probably couldn't have ordered the weather any better in the last 12 months, it's just been sensational for us. And we did get those five pits of silage put away after all, even though we were milking 60 or 80 more cows and everything just came together once we were milking a few more cows, and I think financially it started working, so our heads became clearer once that started working. 

Sheena Carter: So I guess it's really been a recovery phase post drought and fires, and I think building feed inventory is probably front of mind for a lot of people once they got the opportunity to do it. And like you alluded to, Kevin, there's a lot of farmers in the New South Wales industry, particularly on the coastal strip, that are really struggling with accessing feed even now, so yes, I know you're a bit reluctant to say that it has been good, but you've got to have a good time come around to recover from the others and build yourself up for the future ones. Obviously, we're getting to the point that you've actually purchased the farm. You know, there's numerous things that you’ve got to go through to obviously do this in terms of financial support and things like this, but how did the support group assist you through this phase in approaching the bank successfully? 

Brodie Game: Number one, the support group actually had our back – they sort of gave us that push. We were doing a lot of things behind the scenes, we started to work with Phil Shannon in doing up a proposal to put to the bank because the finances and the cash flow probably don't portray that we could do it, but we've been paying off a lease for however many years now, and we've gone from two to what we are now. So we knew we could do it, we just had to prove to a bank that we could do it and work out some way of getting that first initial foot in the door without having a 60% deposit, because if we were trying to save that deposit the land was growing faster than our savings could.

Kevin Game: Just going back a little bit in regards to buying those extra cows. We still had debt on the original herd of which we paid off in, I’m not sure what it was, but it was less than six months and we got that debt out of the road. That was the first step to make repayments on the farm effectively. 

Sheena Carter: And I guess you can demonstrate through what you've done over the last, whatever it is ten, twelve years, to a financier that you've got the skills and the aptitude and the commitment to be able to service debt, whether it's lease repayments or whatever it is. 

Kevin Game: That was another surprising thing with the banks, as I thought all that personal side of it had gone, but our story really had a big impact on it. Like you said, we had demonstrated that we could actually do it and we had been through tough times and got through them and, you know, they wanted to know how we were going to do that again if it had of happened. 

Brodie Game: It’s just another instance that reinforced to us how important those relationships are along the way, because there's been so many things that you can't just write a checklist of how we got from A to B because those relationships played such a critical role in a lot of steps along the way, so they can't be discounted for what they helped us achieve. We certainly haven't done it on our own, we're here but there’s people that have helped us along the way.

Sheena Carter: Yeah, I think it's very difficult to do anything completely in isolation and I guess it's finding the right people and aligning yourselves with them, and I think, it seems that you've both done that very well, which is a credit to both of you. You've had a proposal to go to the bank with some help from Phil Shannon and it's obviously come off so, congratulations! Now proud landowners and continuing your journey with farm ownership but it's not all of the farm, you’ve still got lease country that forms part of your business. 

Kevin Game: Yeah that's right, we still lease 250 acres of dry land off the same fella that we bought the farm off, and also a 350 acre irrigation block up the road, which was just another good opportunity that I didn't want to let go, and it's been very beneficial in regards to be getting that silage underground and, you know, growing good heifers out and stuff like that. 

Sheena Carter: I was going to ask you, what's been the biggest win for you so far as the Focus Farm? And I guess, probably the obvious one is realising that goal of a farm ownership, but I'm perhaps putting words in your mouth. What have been some of the benefits to you so far in being involved in the program? 

Brodie Game: I think our confidence in ourselves and our ability to make decisions has been a pretty big one. It's not something that you can really put on paper and show how it's grown, but from that first point of realising that we actually did have a support group that were behind us, and of course, Justin and Phil, not that we voiced it, I don't think, but we are able to make those decisions and make those calls that we think through a bit more thoroughly and know what's going to work for us and what's not. I mean, we're at the point where we’re a little more okay with taking a risk. 

Kevin Game: I’ll just add in there too, staff was a big issue for us when we started the Focus Farm and I'd never been to school on how to manage staff, so I just treated them the way I was treated in the 15 years prior while I was working for people and, you know, in this day and age that wasn't working totally well for us. So we brought that up and that was a big discussion for a couple of the meetings. Ultimately, it's landed us a fantastic team of people that are working for us now that we've never had before either, so that's definitely helped. 

Sheena Carter: Yes, labour’s always, yeah, it's the perennial challenge isn't it? So if you’ve managed to get that one to work in the business that is key. You can’t operate the business without people and good business, yeah, that's fantastic. Look, Justin, I guess we might head back to you now, and the journey that Kevin and Brodie have taken has been an incredible one, and I guess you've got one year to go now with them and the Focus Farm Project. What do you see coming in the next 12 months and beyond for the Focus Farm with Kevin and Brodie? 

Justin Walsh: Well, I think that now that they've successfully purchased the home farm I think that, essentially, we'll have a shift in the focus of the Focus Farm for the remaining, sort of, just under 12 months now. And it'll really shift to really trying to hone in on the operational performance of the business as well as some strategic capital investment that wouldn't have been appropriate in a leasing arrangement. So it goes back to that point of what, getting inside Kevin and Brodie’s head, about initially in that first year, many of the support group, we could see there's probably some things that we could invest some money in to try and help Kevin and Brodie, or reduce our overall labour or lower our costs of production potentially, but when you're in a lease situation it's not actually the appropriate thing to do. So now that we've got this really tremendous opportunity, now that Kevin and Brodie are owners, that some of those things that we had previously thought about or talked about, now may be appropriate to do now. So it'll really be a tale of two halves, this Focus Farm, of the pre and post purchase. It's a fascinating journey and I'm obviously really excited to see where it goes, not just for the next 12 months, because as I said to Kevin and Brodie at the first time I met them on the farm was, essentially, I'd love the Focus Farm to make themselves redundant and get themselves in a position where they can build the confidence, as they've talked about, to make these decisions themselves but still have that support network going through into the future that they can call on at any stage should they need it. So yeah, as I say, I'm really excited about what the next 12 months might bring. 

Sheena Carter: Yeah fantastic, Justin, thank you. I think it'll be great for the industry to catch up at the next open day as well, and get some of the messages and learnings that you've experienced, Kevin and Brodie, out to the wider industry so that others can benefit. So, yeah, any final words from you, Kevin or Brodie? 

Brodie Game: I think just that there is a lot of opportunity out there for young people, but also the people that are farm owners already, Don Spence, who we bought the farm off, he was willing to take a punt on us all those years ago and help facilitate us into that next step, and a lot of these opportunities wouldn't have been possible without him. So I think there is room for that mind shift from that older generation of, not necessarily helping, but supporting young people into farming. 

Kevin Game: It emphasises the importance of building those relationships because, you know, over the six years that we've leased the farm, and Brodie says it all the time, he's more of a grandfather to her than a landlord. So, it's just been fantastic to establish that with him and ultimately lead us to owning his farm. 

Brodie Game: Or a mentor if he doesn't appreciate being called a grandfather. 

Kevin Game: Yeah. 

Sheena Carter: Look, you've had an incredible journey. There's obviously been incredible highs and incredible lows, but I think you've done exceptionally well and hopefully others can learn from your journey as well, and like you say, Brodie, they realise that there's opportunities there. And I think, Kevin, you know, networking is key – don't underestimate it, and yeah, you're the shining light in that, I think. Look, this has been a fantastic discussion so I would like to thank you all very much. Thank you for opening up your story and your journey to us on the podcast, Kevin and Brodie, and Justin, it's been fantastic to have your insight and perceptions around their business, and it's obviously been very rewarding to be part of the Focus Farm thus far, and another exciting 12 months to come as we work towards wrapping up the Focus Farm. So thank you all very much for your time today, it's been wonderful. 

Kevin Game: Thanks for having us. 

Brodie Game: Yeah, thanks Sheena, thanks Justin. 

Justin Walsh: Thanks very much. 

Sheena Carter: Thank you for listening to this month's The Business of Dairy Podcast, produced by the New South Wales Department of Primary Industries Dairy Business Advisory Unit. This series is also brought to you with funding and support from the Hunter Local Land Services. I hope you enjoyed this session as much as I did. To continue following Kevin and Brodie's journey through opportunities such as the open days, please contact Dairy New South Wales and follow their Facebook page. If you are in New South Wales and interested in becoming a Focus Farm yourself, keep an eye out for information from Dairy New South Wales towards the end of this year or reach out to your local regional development officer as they will begin recruitment for the next farm in due course. Dairy Australia also has an excellent resource for setting up fair and equitable lease arrangements with checklists and templates – a link has been included in the show notes. We'd love you to share this podcast with your networks and feel free to send any feedback or suggestions for future episodes to thebusinessofdairy@gmail.com. You can also subscribe to our New South Wales DPI Dairy Facebook and DPI Livestock Twitter feed and view or subscribe to our quarterly DPI dairy newsletter using the links provided.