Pricing poultry litter and its limitations

For dairy farms located near poultry farms, poultry litter can be a valuable and cost-effective source of fertiliser. With ongoing volatility in fertiliser prices and availability, many farmers are taking a closer look at both the rates they apply and the alternative nutrient sources available to them.

In this episode, I’m joined by agronomist Peter Beale to discuss all things poultry litter — including how to value it, when it makes sense to use it, and some of the practical limitations dairy farmers need to consider. Peter has worked extensively with dairy farmers and is also a previous guest of the podcast.

Resources: 

Factsheet - Best practice guidelines for using poultry litter on pastures

This podcast is an initiative of the NSW DPI Dairy Business Advisory Unit – further information and resources are available here - Dairy | Department of Primary Industries

It is brought to you in partnership with the Hunter Local Land Services

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NSW DPI Dairy Newsletter - Connect with us | Department of Primary Industries 

Transcript - 

Produced by “Pacific Studio” www.pacific.studio 

The information discussed in this podcast are for informative and educational purposes only and do not constitute advice. 

Transcript

00:00:03:05 - 00:00:29:05
Sheena Carter
Welcome to the Business of Dairy podcast. I'm your host, Sheena Carter. Dairy farms, located in close proximity to poultry farms, often use poultry litter as a source of fertilizer. The current environment of volatility in fertilizer pricing and availability has farmers looking at cost effective fertilizer options, both in terms of application rates normally used on farms and alternative sources.

00:00:29:07 - 00:00:57:01
Sheena Carter
Joining me to talk all things poultry later is Peter Beale and agronomist, who has worked extensively with dairy farmers and also a previous guest of the podcast. Peter is currently the project officer with the local Land Services Climate Smart Agriculture Program, which is a program supported by the Australian Government through funding from the Natural Heritage Trust under the Climate Smart Agriculture Program.

00:00:57:03 - 00:00:59:20
Sheena Carter
Welcome back to the podcast, Peter.

00:01:00:00 - 00:01:05:13
Peter Beale
Thank you. It's an honor to be here. And yeah, privileged to be a part of your what you're doing.

00:01:05:14 - 00:01:18:21
Sheena Carter
I think it's it's great to have you back again. Now we're talking about poultry, which as a fertilizer source on dairy farms. Can you explain what poultry leader is? What are we actually referring to for those that might not be familiar with it?

00:01:18:23 - 00:01:45:13
Peter Beale
Well, the bulk of the letter that's applied as a fertilizer is it's the litter on the floor from a broiler shed, which the young chicks had grown out from chicks to to market weight. And obviously they defecate on the floor with and there's sawdust or other products for the bedding and they're mixed together. And at the end of the cycle, they they clean those sheds out.

00:01:45:13 - 00:02:15:10
Peter Beale
And there's a mixture of sawdust and with the, the feces. And that contains quite a bit of nutrients. The other source is from caged or hens where they're actually they're in a cage and they're directly dropping feces to a, a belt or something underneath, which gets cleaned out on a regular basis. And so in one sense it's a little bit more pure, but in reality it's they're very similar products in terms of fertilizer use.

00:02:15:11 - 00:02:33:10
Sheena Carter
Okay. Right. So if I'm a dairy farmer and I'm accessing that product I'm getting it, delivered it to my farm, how am I best to store it? Well. Am I storing it and then using it or am I generally using it? As soon as it lands on the farm?

00:02:33:12 - 00:03:00:06
Peter Beale
Well, from a fertilizer point of view and explain this a little bit more, but you do want to use it pretty much as quickly as possible. But practicalities are that you can't always get poultry litter when you want. And and you can't always spread it when you want. And you know, I saw some examples last year where things were just so wet, the poultry litter sat in a heap and it wasn't spread, you know, for quite a while because the ground was just too wet.

00:03:00:12 - 00:03:19:03
Peter Beale
So the reality is, if you do want to use poultry litter, you need to think carefully about where it's going to be stored and the fact that you may not you may not get it exactly when you want it, and you may not be able to spread it when you want. So storage, the least temporary storage is important.

00:03:19:03 - 00:03:22:13
Peter Beale
And understanding some of the implications around that.

00:03:22:15 - 00:03:35:12
Sheena Carter
Right. So how would I. How would I be storing it. Obviously there's potential I guess nutrient loss with holding it for longer periods of time. What are sort of the suggestions around that?

00:03:35:14 - 00:04:00:17
Peter Beale
Well, for many people it's simply just a high spot that is not going to get run on, or it's well drained that you can get access to a tractors. You've got to mover tractors in and out and you want it dry and firm. You know, in the situation I saw last year, the rain was just kept coming. And you do get nutrients effluent flowing out of that going down the paddock.

00:04:00:17 - 00:04:28:22
Peter Beale
And that is potentially a source of pollution to and quite acidic or so. Not not ideal. So in the ideal storage would be concrete. It would be covered because you can lose nutrients in that process. It's usually on the outside because it forms a bit of a pack. But definitely you want to be able to somewhere where you're going to have good firm access and to be able to when it's time to go, you can get in and get it off.

00:04:29:01 - 00:04:52:18
Peter Beale
The other thing is to be able to, you know, fence that off from animals so that they can't get access to the, the pile and, and kids to you. They want it to close and smell. So also an issue that neighbors are often not too happy about the smell. So that's that's just a consideration. So so there's a few things to to think about.

00:04:52:20 - 00:05:04:00
Peter Beale
But usually those who use it, they've got a place where they store it and they build things. And obviously if you can bond it and stop any effluent going away from that pile, that's an important thing.

00:05:04:03 - 00:05:22:08
Sheena Carter
Yep. So contain it. So given it comes from poultry sheds, what are some of the key risks regarding this material that people need to be mindful of? You know, we've sort of spoken about the nutrient leaching out of piles and things, but some other things that might need to be factored in given its poultry material.

00:05:22:09 - 00:05:49:07
Peter Beale
Yeah. Look, the number one factor is botulism and its potential to, you know, cause serious and high numbers of deaths and in the dairy herd. And we have had examples of that not too far away and and it's devastating obviously. So it mainly that's a risk with dead body parts in the in the pile and that, you know may or may not be an issue.

00:05:49:09 - 00:06:17:03
Peter Beale
But yeah. So vaccination before if you're really going to use poultry you're really got to be before you start using it. You have a vaccination program. Yes. And I talking with Neil Moss just only a couple of days ago. Yeah. He's seen, you know, significant benefits by doing that. Right. So so that's number one. There are other issues like or any fecal material can have fecal pathogens and particularly poultry litter.

00:06:17:04 - 00:06:38:05
Peter Beale
Salmonella is an issue. So you you know you don't want the kids to be playing in the pile. So yeah, it needs to be fenced off from both from livestock and from from people. And when you're spreading it to understand that, yeah, there's it can be dusty if and that it can blow in the wind. So you don't want people around when you're spreading it.

00:06:38:05 - 00:07:02:22
Peter Beale
There is a smell issue. But over time and we once it's spread, then the UV light from the sun actually reduces a lot of those pathogen risks. And if we look at it in the context of how much poultry litters been used over the last 30, 40 years, the risks are fairly low. But nonetheless, you should treat it with caution.

00:07:02:24 - 00:07:04:04
Sheena Carter
Still something to manage?

00:07:04:05 - 00:07:39:23
Peter Beale
Yeah, there is another, probably less so. Risk is that there is heavy metals, you know, zinc and other things that if you use large amounts, those things can build up in the soil. But you know, again, most people don't. They use it for a period of time. And then the phosphorus levels build up. Now this is another consideration that, you know, Neil Griffiths did a trial over 7 or 8 years where you compared poultry letter to conventional fertilizers, and the phosphorus levels just increased exponentially towards the end.

00:07:39:24 - 00:08:14:07
Peter Beale
So and that comes down to the fact that poultry letter has nitrogen. It has, we say around 3% nitrogen. But it really can vary quite a lot around that. And with phosphorus at 1.8%. But the plant if we just look at a plant need, it's around about 3% nitrogen and 0.25%. So if we're just relying on poultry letter as the only fertilizer, then phosphorus builds up quite considerably in excess.

00:08:14:08 - 00:08:40:17
Peter Beale
And that can be diagnosed by doing soil testing and monitoring. Yeah. But that is from an industry point of view. We and we need to see that in context that we know that, you know, 70 to 80% of the paddocks in dairies already adequate in terms of their phosphorus requirement. And this comes into the costing to that. If you don't need the phosphorus and you don't need the potassium, then you know, what are you paying for.

00:08:40:18 - 00:09:11:08
Peter Beale
You're paying for nitrogen. Yes. But as an industry, yeah, we we don't want to be increasing phosphorus levels that will produce runoff. And you know that my effect to rivers and streams and it's a waste of a resource to, you know, that phosphorus is a vital resource and can be used very profitably in, in certain situations, particularly when you if you have a paddock that you've just bought a farm and it hasn't been fertilized much, poultry litter is a great, good solution.

00:09:11:09 - 00:09:19:06
Peter Beale
Yeah. Price what you're still going to look at your prices, but that's where it really fits whether you're a dairy farm or a beef farm.

00:09:19:08 - 00:09:31:05
Sheena Carter
Okay, great. We'll probably talk about some of those aspects a bit later on. But look culturally there's obviously it's a bulky product. How do farmers typically spread it on farm.

00:09:31:06 - 00:09:51:19
Peter Beale
Well you'd need belt spreaders. So the right, you know, marshal type spreaders that have a belt system and a, you know, usually a twin rotor at the back there limits to to how low you can go with those spreaders. If you, you know, it's not just bulky, it's also it's not a even thing. Sometimes there's a bit Claudy comes out.

00:09:51:24 - 00:09:53:12
Peter Beale
So it's difficult.

00:09:53:13 - 00:09:57:05
Sheena Carter
So you mean low low as in terms of application rates.

00:09:57:06 - 00:10:24:02
Peter Beale
Yeah. If you get to low application rates it's hard to make sure it's it's actually even. Right. Yeah. Because you've got a range of particle sizes in that pile. And some will spread a long way in others. But so generally that's overcome by yeah, using higher rates. But you have to watch a swath width and just see how far machines vary dramatically and in how they perform.

00:10:24:04 - 00:10:28:05
Peter Beale
Need to calibrate it a little bit before you set off.

00:10:28:07 - 00:10:32:24
Sheena Carter
A farm is typically do they have this machinery themselves or are they getting contractors in?

00:10:33:00 - 00:10:58:02
Peter Beale
I think most who use it regularly have those machines because they can use it for other products, to use it for spreading urea and other normal fertilizers. But yeah, obviously these pottery litter, you can't spread it in some of the more, you know, PTO mounted cone types. It's it's just this doesn't work. But a lot of the dairy farmers will have those belt spreaders anyway.

00:10:58:02 - 00:11:00:15
Peter Beale
So it does does fit the bill.

00:11:00:17 - 00:11:25:18
Sheena Carter
Yeah. So you mentioned you can't really dial back the application right. Because of that uniformity of distribution. So in terms of applying it, is this something you know typically with say you as farmers might put that on after each grazing, every second grazing, whatever their program is. That might not be happening with poultry litter because of that challenge of low or trying to apply at lower rates.

00:11:25:20 - 00:11:47:23
Peter Beale
Yeah, that's a big part of it. And I think typically it will be applied once or twice a year in larger amounts, and a lot comes back to the price. And we can talk about this later. But price does vary dramatically. So the role of poultry letter you know, depends very much on price and obviously how much you can put on.

00:11:48:00 - 00:12:06:18
Peter Beale
We're in a different situation this year in that you're although it's coming down in price. I hear of some being sold as low as $1,200 a tonne. There's still supply issues that you can't always get it when you want. Yes. But yes. If if you're going to apply poultry letter and you can get it for the price and we'll refine that later.

00:12:06:18 - 00:12:28:04
Peter Beale
But, yeah, you tend to apply larger amounts that are going to last through the season. And Neil's work showed that where you do that, you can get really quite good production. It's not as good as having your ear at on time, but in this year it's better than not having anything because our paddocks can so dependent on nitrogen.

00:12:28:07 - 00:12:40:02
Peter Beale
And if we don't have that coming, if we don't have anything, I've seen some just dramatic results this year, which are really disheartening. It's simply because you don't, you know, couldn't get their ear on time.

00:12:40:04 - 00:13:03:07
Sheena Carter
Yes, a very challenging time. And I think we're still in that volatile situation regarding pricing and availability. Hence hence our conversation. Now when we're applying, we know with if we're spreading dairy effluent, we have with holding periods before we can typically get back onto the paddock and and graze it. Can you tell us about withholding periods with poultry litter?

00:13:03:08 - 00:13:28:00
Peter Beale
Yeah. Look the main criteria is three weeks. And you need that to get a response to the fertilizer to you. And you're not going to get a response unless things are wet. Putting it on dry ground. You're not going to get a response. So and a lot of that is to allow, you know, any body parts or to break down or be simply eaten by foxes and removed.

00:13:28:02 - 00:13:46:05
Peter Beale
But a lot of on farms, you know, most dead birds and things out there removed from the shed. So they're not it's not a it's an unusual problem more than a but but nonetheless that you need to be aware that some may have got through the system and don't take that risk.

00:13:46:07 - 00:14:10:08
Sheena Carter
Yeah. Just be mindful. And I guess, you know, given the this is being recorded in July of 2026 and we have detected in Australia we've got bird flu being detected in migratory bird populations. It's certainly hasn't been found in commercial poultry flocks at this point. But again, it's, you know, one of those other biosecurity things to keep in front of mind with those withholding periods.

00:14:10:09 - 00:14:12:04
Peter Beale
Yes. Yeah. No that's true.

00:14:12:06 - 00:14:22:13
Sheena Carter
And reinforcing the your earlier comment about vaccinating against botulism with the potential of no bird parts in there.

00:14:22:14 - 00:14:34:13
Peter Beale
Yeah. And bear in mind some of your highest risk is is the actual storage site. But if the animals get into that, you know, once it's in the paddock and it's had that withholding period, the risks, you know, go down quite a lot.

00:14:34:18 - 00:15:01:21
Sheena Carter
Yes. Yes. Okay. So you've spoken a bit about the nitrogen, phosphorus and potassium contents of poultry litter. I'm guessing it's it's not a uniform product. It's not a manufactured product. So that nutrient analysis is going to vary depending on the batch. Would that be fair to say. And should you be testing for nutrient content.

00:15:01:23 - 00:15:23:24
Peter Beale
Look there's always an ideal of being asked to test. And but there's a lot of variables. It's not just the batch, it's the location in the in the shed and how well it's mixed. And theoretically, you know, and it makes sense the longer the birds are in the on the litter, the higher the concentration of feces. And so nutrients should be there and some of the day.

00:15:24:00 - 00:15:53:07
Peter Beale
Turkey litter for example, was always tell it as being higher concentration because this is a longer period bend. And there's both our differences when you've also got, you know, you're mixing and the broiler situation, you're mixing with sawdust or and other other bedding products compared to layer, which is more pure. But we did some surveys that goes back to 2010 and they show quite there's a lot of variation even within broiler litter.

00:15:53:07 - 00:16:27:13
Peter Beale
For example, out of 22 samples in 1997, they all did some work varied from 1.96 up to 13.4% nitrogen, with an average of 4.9 in 2010, at varied from 2.5 to 5.6, with an average of 3.7. So and there'll be very within the load. So for someone to bring pottery litter on onto your farm and to to test it, you'd have to do a lot of testing to really get it right.

00:16:27:14 - 00:16:58:02
Peter Beale
So I think the real issue is, you know, security of supply, working, developing, you know, it's the same as anything developing relationships with consistent suppliers. Most of the poultry farms are well aware of the ups and downs. And and then there's some of the larger transport companies that also work with it. And just personally, I, I would ultimately be going back to some of these figures and just working on averages because there will be a variation.

00:16:58:04 - 00:17:13:15
Peter Beale
Yeah. And in that we know there's variation. So we know that if we're going to buy poultry litter, we need it needs to be less than commercial products because you're not going to get us even an application or, or you've got that variability. So you need to hedge your bets a bit that way.

00:17:13:17 - 00:17:22:00
Sheena Carter
Yeah okay. Sure. So I guess the if we're using those those average values. So what did you say. We've got about 3% three.

00:17:22:01 - 00:17:52:04
Peter Beale
Yeah three years sort of an average that we work with. And we that's the scent dry matter. So pottery is often let's say 69%, 76%, 68% dry matter. So there's and varying loads. Well that's another variable they'll have if way the truck you'll have a, you know, potentially 40% of that's or 20 to 40% water. So that comes into it.

00:17:52:04 - 00:18:26:05
Peter Beale
And it's usually sold as cubic meters. And over the the period of testing that nails done it generally and it varies around this 2.5m is around about 1000kg of dry matter. Right. So if you're buying applying 2.5m to per the hectare, you're applying 1000kg of dry matter, of which there will be roughly 30kg of actual nitrogen in or available nitrogen.

00:18:26:07 - 00:18:27:17
Sheena Carter
Yeah, yeah.

00:18:27:19 - 00:18:31:18
Peter Beale
So that's how you and you work through the, the costing from that basis.

00:18:31:23 - 00:18:51:14
Sheena Carter
Okay. Great. Now while we're it's not nutrients as such or not NPCs, but we're talking a lot about carbon and storing carbon in soils these days. And obviously poultry is an organic material. Does it play a role in carbon storage in soils.

00:18:51:15 - 00:19:17:18
Peter Beale
Well, it doesn't it doesn't. It's not necessarily like it's again, the figures that, you know, it's 36, 41% carbon you're applying. So there's a, you know, that means if you're applying a tonne for the hectare, there's 360 kilos of carbon going on. But what happens is that goes into the soil that the microbes in the soil actually break that down, and in doing so release some of the nutrients.

00:19:17:18 - 00:19:43:20
Peter Beale
But they're also releasing their respire, which means they take carbon and use it for the energy. And they emit CO2, which is just, you know, we all do that. Yeah. So the actual amount of carbon that goes in from the product is, is a lot less than what you think. But as we build soil fertility up, you ultimately you end up storing a lot more carbon over time.

00:19:43:22 - 00:20:02:22
Peter Beale
Now there's a there's a limit to that. But yes soils and we see this on effluent paddocks. Two long term use of poultry letter will increase carbon in the soil provided you know that. But a lot of that is coming from the increased productivity that you're experiencing from the grasses.

00:20:02:24 - 00:20:28:21
Sheena Carter
Yes. Yes. So I guess typically we see and this is a general statement, but if you're on your milking platform where they're highly productive pastures, you know, they've got good nutrient applications so we can get that growth out of them. The carbon levels on milking platforms probably are nearly in a dairy industry anyway, probably nearly at their biological capacity anyway.

00:20:28:22 - 00:20:50:24
Peter Beale
That's true. That's true. Yeah. And that's where I was, you know, from that point of view, you're looking to yeah, it's new paddocks, paddocks that have been run down. We'll have, you know, a lot of, I mean some silage where there's a lot of silage taken off that can actually reduce organic matter and, and other nutrients. So that would help.

00:20:51:05 - 00:21:27:07
Peter Beale
The other one that's not talked about a lot is that poultry litter. And it showed in Neil's results that the P8 does have a sort of stabilizing effect. Right. And in some of the US work I've looked at that. That can actually influence for to depth, which is one of the holy grail about P8. So in you know, in particular the last 6 or 7 years of Neil's work from 2010 to 2016, the poultry letter was quite significantly higher than the the normal fertilizer.

00:21:27:09 - 00:21:28:10
Peter Beale
Right, right.

00:21:28:11 - 00:21:33:01
Sheena Carter
So so does that mean that it have benefits where we've got acidic soils or.

00:21:33:02 - 00:21:54:09
Peter Beale
Yeah yeah yeah. But but the trouble is you know we're limited by the mount of phosphorus. The phosphorus levels went up well above what we should be using. But but nonetheless it's, it's something to to bear in mind that it's there are other benefits. And I'm working my project at the moment. We're looking at acid soils in particular.

00:21:54:09 - 00:22:13:24
Peter Beale
And the Holy grail is getting we can put lime on the surface, but getting it to influence down to depth is quite difficult. So and I think poultry litters a local natural well, not natural, but a local resource. So if we combine the two, it's something I'll be looking into in the next couple of years.

00:22:14:01 - 00:22:44:18
Sheena Carter
Interesting, interesting. Very good. Now, you recently wrote an article in a local dairy publication called the Midcoast Dairy Advancement Group's Dairy Droppings Newsletter, and you ran some numbers on the economics of using poetry letter. In the article, you calculated at the time that if you're applying poultry for its nitrogen content, it worked out at an equivalent area price of about a bit over $1,500 a tonne.

00:22:44:20 - 00:22:50:10
Sheena Carter
Can you talk us through your calculations and the economic implications of using poultry leader?

00:22:50:12 - 00:23:24:08
Peter Beale
Yeah, look, I wrote that article because of the shortage. And just to try and qualify and this to two ways of looking at one pure theoretical that let's say you've got applying 2.5m per hectare, which is 1000kg of dry matter per hectare. Applying. Then you're applying 30kg of nitrogen. Now it's very dependent on on price, but with often talk about poultry that are being able to be applied at around about $40 per meter.

00:23:24:10 - 00:23:51:14
Peter Beale
And that means, you know, if you're buying it at that level, it's around about $120 per tonne plus your spreading cost. And you have and spreading costs are going to be higher because it's a slower process. Right. But if it's $120 a tonne and it's 30kg, then that each kilogram is worth about $4. Now we get quite a lot of variability in the price.

00:23:51:15 - 00:24:28:17
Peter Beale
Now the part of that is transport costs. The further you are away from a shared obviously the more the transport costs. But we found last year, particularly through the wet conditions when people couldn't spread it, that, you know, there was a number of people buying pottery letter for $26 a cubic meter, not 40. So when the price comes down like that and you need nitrogen plus plus some of the other nutrients potassium and and phosphorus, so you know, some of those paddocks city you've taken a lot of with, with silage or you know, if we look at the maize silage system it's very demanding of nutrients.

00:24:28:18 - 00:24:52:20
Peter Beale
So that's another area where applying poultry litter can be really quite a useful product. So and if you're getting it at those low low costs and that's bringing the price back down to two and $3, which is is still quite economic at this point in time. That said you know the market say it's a it's a moving target at the moment.

00:24:52:21 - 00:25:22:07
Peter Beale
And but still $1,200 is is still quite a bit more than what we're used to. Yes. There's still a margin in that. Quite a healthy margin. And I you know, you probably preferred product but but if you can't get it, the, the losses of not having nitrogen on is huge. So yes, that's where in this situation, you know, you can be paying not much more than that $40 a meter.

00:25:22:09 - 00:25:33:05
Peter Beale
Right. But that gives you some sort of room to negotiate around and, and, and not lose production, which is really important.

00:25:33:07 - 00:25:44:19
Sheena Carter
Yes, absolutely. Well, because if you're losing production, if you haven't got the grass, you've your only option is to buy it from somewhere else, isn't it. Which is it can be challenging, can be expensive depending on conditions at the time.

00:25:45:00 - 00:25:46:11
Peter Beale
Yes. Yeah.

00:25:46:14 - 00:25:59:12
Sheena Carter
So are there any other considerations that we need to be mindful of when we're using Poultry Leader and or what are some of the potential yields from using poultry litter that we might have seen?

00:25:59:14 - 00:26:32:08
Peter Beale
Well, Neil, did this trial work. Neil Griffiths, who was the agronomist at the we both worked with for many years a toe Carl and he did some really useful work where he he was putting on high rates of poultry literature at the time. You know, it's not so cows not far from the poultry sheds. He I think he averaged around the 15.7 tonnes per hectare just using litter in one application for the year where he was applying fertilizers, which the difference there is you get the timing better.

00:26:32:10 - 00:26:56:06
Peter Beale
Yeah, he got higher yields but that was really only up around 17. And in many years you know dry conditions limited yields more than the the nutrients that were applied. So they're quite substantial yields. And compared to the the dairy dairy up figures that we've been collecting over the last couple of years. They're in the ballpark of really good, quite good production.

00:26:56:06 - 00:26:58:23
Peter Beale
And they were irrigated to some degree.

00:26:59:00 - 00:27:04:21
Sheena Carter
And just to clarify this is on ryegrass you. Yes yes yes yes. Yeah.

00:27:05:01 - 00:27:30:17
Peter Beale
Yeah. So it's just really nutrients. It's a matter of getting the right nutrients and the right time. Just because it's true that it doesn't mean it's going to fix everything. You you have to apply enough nitrogen to, to do the job. And there will be times, you know, and some and one of the things that I think we need to understand is every paddock is really quite different in its residual amount of nitrogen.

00:27:30:19 - 00:27:57:22
Peter Beale
And we tend to just say, I'll put on a kilo or 1.2 kilos a month. Well, particularly with Clarkia coming out of the summer, where you're not applying much nitrogen, the organic carbon levels vary quite a bit and the fertility varies quite a bit. So so again, it's all comes back. I mean I was writing down if there's things what what nutrients do you need is you know, are you buying the product because of nitrogen?

00:27:57:24 - 00:28:16:14
Peter Beale
If so, you know, we've got those guidelines of how to calculate that. What is the price? You know, what, what price can to get it landed for. And the ability is it, you know, if you're going to have to wait two months, but you need it now, you need to be looking at other things so that you get the timing right.

00:28:16:16 - 00:28:34:16
Peter Beale
And I think I know I was talking with George Tiedemann the other day and he's they're just doing it, applying it twice a year before sowing and using, you know, your ear at other times. So, so you can work. It's not us and them. It's trying to.

00:28:34:16 - 00:28:35:15
Sheena Carter
Work in your program.

00:28:35:16 - 00:28:45:09
Peter Beale
Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you really do need to understand how many kilos of nitrogen a year applying at that particular time. And how much does the plant really need.

00:28:45:12 - 00:28:50:09
Sheena Carter
Yes, yes. So so so. Well, testing will be key amongst all these planning.

00:28:50:09 - 00:29:15:04
Peter Beale
Well and just observing. You know, I think we can observe a lot by how the pasture is growing, the, the relationship between neuron stains and the rest of the pasture. Tell us a lot about just how fertile it is. And but at the moment it's can you get the product and can can you apply it? And if there is, you know, a reliable good source, then it certainly has a value.

00:29:15:04 - 00:29:35:01
Peter Beale
And and when we're talking maize silage it's, it has a huge value. Yeah. Because that can be your base fertilizer before you apply some of these other things and can apply high rates and corporate IT or and then top up with your rear later on. So that's okay. Yeah. Yeah yeah.

00:29:35:06 - 00:30:00:11
Sheena Carter
No. Fantastic. I think we've, we've covered a lot around the complexities of poultry leader. And we actually I will put a link in the show notes. There's a best practice guide to using poultry litter. So I'll put that in in the show notes so listeners can access that. That has a lot of very useful information in it about use and management of poultry litter.

00:30:00:11 - 00:30:10:23
Sheena Carter
But finally, have you got any key messages for farmers looking to use or even those who are currently using poultry with any, any key takeaways for those people?

00:30:10:24 - 00:30:33:09
Peter Beale
Well, I think I'm well, one thing I would like to say is that we have to acknowledge the work that Neil Griffiths did over the years in, in, you know, refining this and being able to go back over some of his research and articles is really, you know, provided a good grounding. So there's material there to read. I think, as I said before, it, does it fit your situation.

00:30:33:09 - 00:30:50:20
Peter Beale
Can you you know. Have you got the equipment to spread it. Is it reliable and can you get it when you need it. There. The there the big issues. Pete. Yeah. But if you're going to use it then, you know, vaccination for botulism is a mandatory.

00:30:50:22 - 00:31:07:04
Sheena Carter
Yes mandatory. And and mind your what you're withholding periods before you're hopping on them. Yes. And grazing it again. Yeah yeah yeah. Fantastic. Well thank you very much for your time, Peter. It's been a couple of years since we've had you on the podcast, and we'll probably get you back in another couple for safety very much.

00:31:07:07 - 00:31:10:18
Peter Beale
Thanks. And thanks for all the things you're doing. It's great. Great work.

00:31:10:19 - 00:31:35:23
Sheena Carter
No. Great. Appreciate it. Thanks. That's all for today's episode of The Business of Dairy. We hope you enjoyed diving into the fascinating world of dairy farming and industry insights, as we continue to expand and evolve. We greatly appreciate your support. Our show is thriving, attracting new listeners each week, but we believe there's always room to grow and we need your help to make it happen.

00:31:36:00 - 00:32:00:06
Sheena Carter
If you've found value in our discussions, we kindly ask you to take a moment to rate and leave a comment about the podcast on your preferred platform. Your feedback not only lets us know what you enjoy, but also helps boost our visibility to others who might benefit from our content. I sincerely thank you for being part of our community, and we look forward to bringing you more engaging episodes in the future.

00:32:00:09 - 00:32:09:19
Sheena Carter
With the continued funding and support of the Hunter Local Land Services. Until next time day. Curious and keep milking those opportunities.